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	<title>Comments on: Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 1 of 5)</title>
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	<link>http://umso.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/closed-system-vs-open-system-why-the-open-system-fails-part-1-of-5/</link>
	<description>The University's Rational Egoists</description>
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		<title>By: Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 4 of 5) &#171; University of Michigan Students of Objectivism</title>
		<link>http://umso.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/closed-system-vs-open-system-why-the-open-system-fails-part-1-of-5/#comment-61</link>
		<dc:creator>Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 4 of 5) &#171; University of Michigan Students of Objectivism</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Apr 2009 01:07:59 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>[...] on April 2, 2009 at 8:01 pm Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 1 of 5) &#171; University of Michiga... [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] on April 2, 2009 at 8:01 pm Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 1 of 5) &laquo; University of Michiga&#8230; [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 3 of 5) &#171; University of Michigan Students of Objectivism</title>
		<link>http://umso.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/closed-system-vs-open-system-why-the-open-system-fails-part-1-of-5/#comment-58</link>
		<dc:creator>Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 3 of 5) &#171; University of Michigan Students of Objectivism</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Apr 2009 01:05:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://umso.wordpress.com/?p=30#comment-58</guid>
		<description>[...] on April 2, 2009 at 8:01 pm Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 1 of 5) &#171; University of Michiga... [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] on April 2, 2009 at 8:01 pm Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 1 of 5) &laquo; University of Michiga&#8230; [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 2 of 5) &#171; University of Michigan Students of Objectivism</title>
		<link>http://umso.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/closed-system-vs-open-system-why-the-open-system-fails-part-1-of-5/#comment-54</link>
		<dc:creator>Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 2 of 5) &#171; University of Michigan Students of Objectivism</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Apr 2009 01:03:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>[...] August 4, 2008 by Roderick    (Previous in the series: Part 1) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] August 4, 2008 by Roderick    (Previous in the series: Part 1) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 5 of 5) &#171; University of Michigan Students of Objectivism</title>
		<link>http://umso.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/closed-system-vs-open-system-why-the-open-system-fails-part-1-of-5/#comment-49</link>
		<dc:creator>Closed System vs. Open System: Why the Open System Fails (Part 5 of 5) &#171; University of Michigan Students of Objectivism</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Apr 2009 00:47:11 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>[...] 4, 2008 by Roderick    (Previous posts in the series: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4 )  Why the Closed System is Misunderstood, and the Strawmen that are [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] 4, 2008 by Roderick    (Previous posts in the series: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4 )  Why the Closed System is Misunderstood, and the Strawmen that are [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Roderick</title>
		<link>http://umso.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/closed-system-vs-open-system-why-the-open-system-fails-part-1-of-5/#comment-20</link>
		<dc:creator>Roderick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 17:36:43 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Thanks for the praise.

(1) Regarding the open system advocates and Aristotle&#039;s philosophy: I don&#039;t think so, since they&#039;re only concerned with Objectivism.

I wouldn&#039;t know (besides Kelley perhaps) if they consider other philosophies &quot;open&quot; in the sense that Objectivism is to them.  

Kelley in T&amp;T says that systems like Aristotle&#039;s and Plato&#039;s are &quot;philosophical systems&quot;--philosophies which address a wide range of issues (&#039;problems&#039; ) in the branches of philosophy.  Part of the justification for the open system view is Kelley&#039;s personal view that Objectivism really *isn&#039;t* a system, but rather a &quot;foundation and outline of a system,&quot; that still needs to be fleshed out.

(2) My tentative answer is: no.  &quot;Tentative&quot; because among those broad schools of thought (like pragmatism) I&#039;m only familiar with William James&#039; form of pragmatism, and I know little of the Stoics, including Epicurus.

As far as I know of academia, if you form a variation of, say, pragmatism, which was (let&#039;s assume) more consistent than James&#039; version, then you couldn&#039;t simply pronounce that your version must now supersede James&#039; version.  

There would merely be a new system (i.e. yours) within the school of pragmatist thought.  The broad schools of philosophy are &quot;open&quot; in the sense of incorporating new insights and systems as time passes on, but even here one can&#039;t have license to &quot;rewrite&quot; particular philosophies within these schools at will.

In the future, there may be a broad &quot;Objectivist&quot; school of thought, the philosophies of which share certain fundamental views with Rand&#039;s &quot;Objectivism&quot; and are developments from it, but that doesn&#039;t mean that these philosophies can merely change the ideas of Ayn Rand, as Kelley is suggesting (albeit in a skeptical fashion).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the praise.</p>
<p>(1) Regarding the open system advocates and Aristotle&#8217;s philosophy: I don&#8217;t think so, since they&#8217;re only concerned with Objectivism.</p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t know (besides Kelley perhaps) if they consider other philosophies &#8220;open&#8221; in the sense that Objectivism is to them.  </p>
<p>Kelley in T&amp;T says that systems like Aristotle&#8217;s and Plato&#8217;s are &#8220;philosophical systems&#8221;&#8211;philosophies which address a wide range of issues (&#8216;problems&#8217; ) in the branches of philosophy.  Part of the justification for the open system view is Kelley&#8217;s personal view that Objectivism really *isn&#8217;t* a system, but rather a &#8220;foundation and outline of a system,&#8221; that still needs to be fleshed out.</p>
<p>(2) My tentative answer is: no.  &#8220;Tentative&#8221; because among those broad schools of thought (like pragmatism) I&#8217;m only familiar with William James&#8217; form of pragmatism, and I know little of the Stoics, including Epicurus.</p>
<p>As far as I know of academia, if you form a variation of, say, pragmatism, which was (let&#8217;s assume) more consistent than James&#8217; version, then you couldn&#8217;t simply pronounce that your version must now supersede James&#8217; version.  </p>
<p>There would merely be a new system (i.e. yours) within the school of pragmatist thought.  The broad schools of philosophy are &#8220;open&#8221; in the sense of incorporating new insights and systems as time passes on, but even here one can&#8217;t have license to &#8220;rewrite&#8221; particular philosophies within these schools at will.</p>
<p>In the future, there may be a broad &#8220;Objectivist&#8221; school of thought, the philosophies of which share certain fundamental views with Rand&#8217;s &#8220;Objectivism&#8221; and are developments from it, but that doesn&#8217;t mean that these philosophies can merely change the ideas of Ayn Rand, as Kelley is suggesting (albeit in a skeptical fashion).</p>
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		<title>By: C. August</title>
		<link>http://umso.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/closed-system-vs-open-system-why-the-open-system-fails-part-1-of-5/#comment-19</link>
		<dc:creator>C. August</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 13:08:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://umso.wordpress.com/?p=30#comment-19</guid>
		<description>Great post.  You make a number of interesting points, and I particularly liked your description of the academic view of closed systems like Aristotle&#039;s and Hume&#039;s.

I wonder, would advocates of the open system view of Objectivism think that Aristotle&#039;s philosophy is also an open system?  Or would they recognize it as closed in the manner you describe?

And on a related note...  I&#039;m curious, based on your experience in academia, if you know of philosophical systems which are generally considered open?  (in the context of the reasonable criteria for closed systems that you described)

In other words, would schools of thought like stoicism, pragmatism, etc., be considered open?  Why, or why not?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post.  You make a number of interesting points, and I particularly liked your description of the academic view of closed systems like Aristotle&#8217;s and Hume&#8217;s.</p>
<p>I wonder, would advocates of the open system view of Objectivism think that Aristotle&#8217;s philosophy is also an open system?  Or would they recognize it as closed in the manner you describe?</p>
<p>And on a related note&#8230;  I&#8217;m curious, based on your experience in academia, if you know of philosophical systems which are generally considered open?  (in the context of the reasonable criteria for closed systems that you described)</p>
<p>In other words, would schools of thought like stoicism, pragmatism, etc., be considered open?  Why, or why not?</p>
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